I took this from a comment,
Let's not forget that Virginia said she wrote the citizens petition for the sewer line bylaw change. Would she have done this petition if it wasn't one of her friends? Would she have done this petition if it was say - Pauly or you or I who was having sewer line problems? Would the people who all signed the petition still sign it?
your thoughts... Thanks Pauly
I looked at the original petition.
ReplyDeleteVirgina Wilder
the Blais'
the Skeltons
Columbus
O'Brien
and a couple of others. You can look at the names if you wish. I do not want to drag their names into this. They were probably duped.
Around 1978 the Town of Templeton voted to have sewer commissioners. The sewer commissioners are empowered to handle all things sewer, hypothetically. It would seem the correct channel to go through would have been for the group of individuals who are concerned about this issue to have gone to the sewer commissioners to address this concern. If the sewer commissioners decided this was not such a good idea then that would have been the end of that. The disturbing thing here is that many of the signatories are past or present elected officials who perhaps should have known this but have decided instead to do an end run. One of the signatories is running for Selectmen and has a history of making up his own set of rules, many of which turn out to be possibly illegal or immoral.
ReplyDeleteThe very idea that this could get the town in trouble legally, the fact that we could end up being responsible for sewer lines that are not ours, should be enough to put the end to this, but do not count on it. We need to ask the sewer commissioners for their opinion. We, meaning the taxpayers in the town of Templeton, have enough to pay for and take care of as it is. At the best, we are stretched to do what we have to. This is one instance where the town attorney should have been able to look at this petition. It's dam if you do, and dam if you don't. Lets hope sane heads will prevale. It as with everything, will come out in the wash. Bev.
DeleteThis commissioner prefers not to tip his hand. You will hear our opinions about this at town meeting. You would think that a person who claims to represent everyone as well as the town would have thought this through more carefully.
ReplyDeleteHow come sometimes it okay for a citizen to bring a petition forward if they so choose and get the necesary signatures or whatever you must do...but then at other times, as with the above sewer issue, there is some type of underhandedness going on and it shouldn't be done. I thought it was up to the people to vote on these citizen's petitions. It appears that because now it is "the other side" bringing a petition it is somehow tantamount to criminal. It appears rather hypocritical to me. If I so desired don't I have every right to try and get a citizen's petition that because I am paying for my child's college I should not have to pay my real estate taxes. I know I am being a bit ridiculous and no one, except maybe others paying college tuition would sign my petition. Do some citizen's have more rights than others in bringing petitions forward?
ReplyDeleterefer to Balwin templeton 1:29 pm
DeleteIn reality, you have as much right to petition for anything you feel is needed, just as I do. In the end, it does not matter what I think, it is what the taxpayers as a group think. The sewer commissioners have the say over what takes place with the sewer department, and I trust their opinion, as they know more about this subject than I do. The timing of this motion has come at a time that is filled with raw feelings, because of the race for selectmen, and the feeling that people are having a hard time making ends meet now, and the future does not look much better. In the end it will come down to a vote of the majority, as it should be. I think this petition would have been received better if it had come from the sewer department, in the first place, but in the end that does not matter. It will come out in the wash. My opinion, Bev.
DeleteHey my comment had nothing to do with sides and all power to being able to bring citizens petition. I was just wondering why Dana didn't write this himself and if Virginia would assist any of us other taxpayers in writing a citizens petition. and just for the record I voted No on the light dept petition
ReplyDeleteThe law is simple, 10 registered voters can bring a petition forward and the selectmen must place that on the warrant for town meeting vote. Perhaps as a sitting selectmen, Virginia may have been wiser to have asked the chair to put this on the agenda at selectmen meeting and tried that avenue first. Also asked for sewer comm to attend the meeting for a joint discussion as BOS meetings are usually well attended. A by-law change needs discussion and thought, not that this particular selectmen, Virginia Wilder, has always followed town by-laws (see settlement for Jeff Ritter) but the process is the law (citizens petition) I believe there is a law suit happening involving sewer now concerning tie in rate of 10 grand vs what I understand was a rate study where a fairer tie in fee of 4500 dollars was talked about so now the town sewer (taxpayers) may be in court over another sewer issue.
ReplyDeleteHi Anon 4:55
ReplyDeleteAnyone can submit a citizen petition for any reason. I think the feeling of underhandedness results when the person submitting the citizen petition is not upfront. In this situation, Dana Blais has every right to submit a citizen petition of this nature. The feeling of underhandedness comes from the fact that Dana didn't submit it, Virginia did.
I have submitted a good number of citizen petitions over the years, and I will continue to do so. When I submit a citizen petition, it will have my name on it. I have encouraged other people to submit citizen petitions if they are concerned about issues.
I can't help but get the feeling there were some people who wanted to slip this citizen petition by without people realizing the full financial impact of this petition on the sewer department and the town.
This petition will be included in the warrant as it should be. It has the requisite number of signatures. The discussion on the blog has brought to light a few issues that bear checking out. Has there been only 1 problem of this nature in 40 years? What is the depth of the sewer lines? Is the owner responsibility to the lateral or the chimney?
How many citizens are impacted by the proposed change? What is the financial impact? How do other towns deal with similar situations?
Blog comments aside, this citizen petition will be decided by people who attend town meeting in May. I'm not sure which night this particular article will be discussed.
Perhaps Dana Blais can enlighten us all on what the process and fees and owner responsibility is as to the water dept. How does the water dept handle the water lines from the main branch to the home entry point. What does it cost a resident to tie into to town water and how much of the pipe is the homeowner responsible for? This subject alone seems reason enough for Templeton to undo a few things and get water and sewer under the same umbrela and have one commission because water and sewer seem to go together like peas n carrotts but water n electricity, not so much. Rather than rush into this sewer change, I would vote no and look and talk a little more, after all, if there is no toilet or sink, what is the rush to change the law.
ReplyDeleteDana called me today. He is on vacation, with Anne. He was upset because I spoke about my feelings toward him as far as being the Chair of the Light and Water. He should have known how I felt, as I got so upset with the Commissioners, at one of our early meetings, I called them all ass H---s. He almost threw me out of the meeting. I still feel they were behaving poorly, and I should have been nicer, but that is water over the dam. There is a difference when we disagree, I did not go after him as a person, but I don't have to like any ones policies. What I told him today is, the people will comment, and if it gets to a point, then we may vote on it. We, and I mean all of us, can agree to disagree. My opinion, Bev.
DeleteIf he school department used $80,000. to renovate an office, I don't think they need an override. $80,000 could have been better spent in other ways. Homeowners & businesses that are financially strapped do not renovate. I will vote no althoug I feel bad that the kids will suffer for poor decisions made by adults hired to look out for their best interest.
ReplyDeleteYes I called Bev the reason was I just wanted to let her know that comments written about her were not from me. I went to a sewer meeting and asked who is responsible for sewer on town property I was told it was the homeowner. Virginia was also there. tom had aletter he wrote about Virginia somthing about her actions at a selecmans meeting. There was some heated discussion then she left. I got a call the day the warrant was open and was asked if I did anything about a petition I sain no Iam prepared to fix it my self , but still think it is not the ratepayers responsibility. Apparently Virginia does not either. I believe Virginia would have written the petition no matter who was at the meeting with a problem. I can fight my own battles
ReplyDelete.She asked me to sign it and I did. To answer Jeffs question a 1 inch water entry fee is 2500.00. The water takes care of water problems from main to property line. Most of the water breaks are where the connection is maid at the main, which if it was sewer it would be ratepayers problem .water spends a lot of time and money fixing problems in the street that are not the water main. Maybe it is time to look at the way it is payed.
At the April 8th meeting I brought up an potential warrant article to address the water mains along Baldwinville Rd. The proposed article was for a capital debt exclusion. I brought this topic up for discussion as a member of the BOS. It got shot down. There was no enough time to formulate a reasonable plan for discussion because the information regarding the age og the water mains along Baldwinville Rd (60+ years old) was submitted to the BOS on Friday April 5th after 6:00 pm.
ReplyDeleteDespite repeated requests for this information from the general manager and the TMLWP Commissioners regarding the water main breaks on July 14, 2012.
Virginia could have brought up the sewer article for discussion as a member of the BOS. It is conjecture on my part, but she probably didn't want it to be shot down, the way my article to attempt to address the aging water infrastructure along Baldwinville Rd was defeated.
So now the worst thing that can happen is this citizen petition passes at ATM in May and bankrupts the sewer department and by extension the town.
I wonder if the selectman would write a citizen's petition to require the water department to discontinue water service to those who are severely in arrears on their sewer charges. Sewer is billed on the amount of water that is used. So far they have refused to do so. It would help to be able to collect over $50K in arrears. All the other users must make up that difference. I bet the water dept does not hesitate to shut off water if the water bills are not paid.
ReplyDeleteI wonder what the candidate for Sewer Commision feels on this subject as well? He seems pretty buddy-buddy with VW as of late.
Delete